The Boating Forum - concerned about this...

THE HULL TRUTH is the world's largest FREE network for the discussion of Boating & Fishing. Whether you're researching a new boat, or are a seasoned Captain, you'll find The Hull Truth Boating & Fishing Message Forum contains a wealth of information from Boaters and Sportfishermen around the world.




View Full Version : concerned about this...


dvd956
03-19-2012, 07:36 AM
Hello everyone ! I bought a Mako 252 not long ago and noticed some cracks that I am worried about, originally the boat came with two 150s but the las owner replaced them with two 200 EFIs, he owned the boat for over 6 years with these motors and never had a problem, but I dont want to go out and be the one loosing the engines !! What should I do ? Thanks
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/Pic028.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/pho2to.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/pho1to.jpg


Bayfly
03-19-2012, 07:52 AM
did you add the sealant to the cracks, or was it that way when you bought it? Either way, you might want to remove some screws and bolts from the transom and see if you can detect any water soaked wood. BTW, always reseal the screw and bolts with a good sealant like 3M 5200. You own it now, so I would do my exam for water and watch it very closely for further flexing. You might even have someone else operate the boat while you observe the cracks. The photos you provided do not show the cracks going down to the deck, or is it just not apparent from the photos?
BTW, there are a lot of transom repair threads on THT which you can review for further insight into how similar problems are aproached for repair.

fishingfun
03-19-2012, 07:52 AM
Your just noticing those cracks? I'd call the guy who you purchased the boat from and ask him about those cracks.


roozter
03-19-2012, 07:54 AM
doesn't look like you're gonna like the news...

I'd be checking the transom and stringers really carefully

dvd956
03-19-2012, 08:09 AM
did you add the sealant to the cracks, or was it that way when you bought it? Either way, you might want to remove some screws and bolts from the transom and see if you can detect any water soaked wood. BTW, always reseal the screw and bolts with a good sealant like 3M 5200. You own it now, so I would do my exam for water and watch it very closely for further flexing. You might even have someone else operate the boat while you observe the cracks. The photos you provided do not show the cracks going down to the deck, or is it just not apparent from the photos?
BTW, there are a lot of transom repair threads on THT which you can review for further insight into how similar problems are aproached for repair.

Sealant was already there, was like that when I got it, owner told me he never had a problem with it, that it had it since he had the 150s, I will look for the transom repair threads anyways ! Thanks

Brezinup
03-19-2012, 08:17 AM
What's the boat rated for?
It's not unusual for cracks to develop in that area. That's the joint for the hull and liner.
It looks like you had a transom mounted transducer on there at one time. Pull those screws and see what you have.

Port Monster
03-19-2012, 08:21 AM
That would concern the hell out of me. I would certainly follow the advice and pull some screws and see if the transom is wet. It would appear to me that they added that big piece angle across teh transom because there was some concern. At the same time, that caulk does look at bit aged and shows no signs of separation so maybe it is stable. My issue us I cannot for the life of me figure out what would cause those cracks other than transom issues.

dvd956
03-19-2012, 08:21 AM
What's the boat rated for?
It's not unusual for cracks to develop in that area. That's the joint for the hull and liner.
It looks like you had a transom mounted transducer on there at one time. Pull those screws and see what you have.

max 400hp

I will take some pics when I get home , Im not really an expert on this matter !!!

jonesg
03-19-2012, 08:44 AM
The transom is shot, stringers are probably gone too.

Buying a boat, thats the first thing I look at, if I see cracks like that...its gone.
No if's and's or exceptions.

Remove an engine bolt and poke around, better yet, drill a hole and examine the drill chips, they don't lie. Fill the hole with whatever, it don't matter because its all coming out.
If the stringers aren't damaged yet, do a composite pour nidacore for the transom.

First Light
03-19-2012, 08:49 AM
Also ask your question here http://www.classicmako.com - it's where a lot of the Mako owners hang out and exchange info and ideas.

dvd956
03-19-2012, 08:54 AM
Also ask your question here http://www.classicmako.com - it's where a lot of the Mako owners hang out and exchange info and ideas.

I sure will !! Thanks

miike
03-19-2012, 09:02 AM
That looks bad. Not just a water issue. Sure, there might be some water in there, but that may not be the cause of the failure. Many transoms are wet and never crack like that. That transom has lost whatever structural members keep it from flexing like that. It needs to be replaced or reinforced. Have a good shop take a look at it.

dvd956
03-19-2012, 09:03 AM
The transom is shot, stringers are probably gone too.

Buying a boat, thats the first thing I look at, if I see cracks like that...its gone.
No if's and's or exceptions.

Remove an engine bolt and poke around, better yet, drill a hole and examine the drill chips, they don't lie. Fill the hole with whatever, it don't matter because its all coming out.
If the stringers aren't damaged yet, do a composite pour nidacore for the transom.

that happens to me cause I'm not a boat expert :-)

hopefully the stringers are good !!! will check later and post pics !

tomharty
03-19-2012, 09:08 AM
Its like they dremeled out the spider cracks and filled with 5200... may not be as bad as it looks. I wouldn't put all the blame the 200s either, probably just like to jump!

capt.pac-man
03-19-2012, 09:12 AM
Sorry for your expensive lesson.:(

jonesg
03-19-2012, 09:14 AM
that happens to me cause I'm not a boat expert :-)

hopefully the stringers are good !!! will check later and post pics !

Neither was I until I bought a boat with a completely rotted transom, it wasn't wood any longer, it was potting soil.
And the cracks were right where yours are, thats the stress point.

Maybe when the sellers car frame cracks he'll use spackle.

I got a cherry picker engine hoist off craigslist for $120 and did it myself, the actual job isn't that big of a deal, de-rigging and re-rigging is a chore. Maybe if you do the prep yourself you could save a few bucks having it done at a shop, time is time.

fishingfun
03-19-2012, 09:22 AM
If I had to guess I bet that's the very reason this guy sold the boat. The fact that he made the effort to tell you he never had any problems with the transom lead me to believe he did. Try raising a motor then push down with your weight on the lower unit to see if the transon has any flex. That caulk even though its dirty around that area looks pretty new.

Gottarpon
03-19-2012, 09:30 AM
That big crack runs all the way to the floor of your splash well you can see the smaller crack in the second picture.

There is no way I would ever run a boat like that at anything other than an idle.

anthropisces
03-19-2012, 09:42 AM
Step 1) Don't panic or beat yourself up. This is an opportunity to get to know your boat better. Anyone on this board that is smart got that way by getting hurt a bunch of times. You are just getting smarter (it does hurt).

Step 2) Definately follow the advice to talk with other Mako owners to get the benefit of their past exerience.

Step 3) Find out if anything is rotted. If so, you'll fix it. Don't jump the gun. There are a lot of ways to do this job. Get a lot of opinions. It may take a couple of weeks but you'll recognize the right solution when it comes to you.

Step 4) Once you've got all of the hidden problems cured, fix that crack properly with heavy cloth and epoxy resin.

When you are done you'll be all the more familiar with your boat making you a bit smarter and a bit better bet at the helm.

jonesg
03-19-2012, 10:14 AM
Step 4) Once you've got all of the hidden problems cured, fix that crack properly with heavy cloth and epoxy resin.

When you are done you'll be all the more familiar with your boat making you a bit smarter and a bit better bet at the helm.

#4, the glass on the top will be cut off and thrown away, a new patch from mat and poly resin , fairing compound and gelcoat, the splashwell crack has to be patched from underneath, easier done by cutting the well off, top repair is more cosmetic than anything else, went through all that. Starts with a little crack, 4 weeks later I'm pulling the tank, cutting the deck off.

Stickbo
03-19-2012, 10:56 AM
Ouch.

Did you have it surveyed? What made you think those cracks were ok?

dvd956
03-19-2012, 11:53 AM
Ouch.

Did you have it surveyed? What made you think those cracks were ok?

No I did not, I jumped on it cause I though it was a nice deal... as I mentioned before I have little/no experience on boats/fiberglass , looks like its the time too start learning now :) I have no other option....

Bertram42
03-19-2012, 12:07 PM
I would drag the boat over to a Fiberglass Repair shop or hire a surveyor and have them put a moisture meter on the transom and sound it out with a hammer. They can tell if there is any moisture or delamination. It may be cosmetic and it may be structural but have an expert look at it before you go ripping things apart.

dvd956
03-19-2012, 12:10 PM
Neither was I until I bought a boat with a completely rotted transom, it wasn't wood any longer, it was potting soil.
And the cracks were right where yours are, thats the stress point.

Maybe when the sellers car frame cracks he'll use spackle.

I got a cherry picker engine hoist off craigslist for $120 and did it myself, the actual job isn't that big of a deal, de-rigging and re-rigging is a chore. Maybe if you do the prep yourself you could save a few bucks having it done at a shop, time is time.

I already have the cherry picker engine hoist !!! A bunch of tools...
but NO experience with fiberglass !!!! !!!! !!!! ( none ) so dont really know where to start, or cut !
I am waiting to get off work to go home and check the stringers !

DaveFromNJ
03-19-2012, 12:21 PM
I would drag the boat over to a Fiberglass Repair shop or hire a surveyor and have them put a moisture meter on the transom and sound it out with a hammer. They can tell if there is any moisture or delamination. It may be cosmetic and it may be structural but have an expert look at it before you go ripping things apart.

Best piece of advice.

A professional armed with a moisture meter and a plastic hammer will be able to tell how much damage is going on under there without tearing the boat up or drilling holes.

kitebuz
03-19-2012, 12:36 PM
What year is the hull - 90's?

There was a similar issue like this on the 282 hull in that time. No one can tell you your prognosis with out looking in more detail. Might be more cosmetic, might be structural. There was a recall done on some of the 282's. If it's structural, you might be best doing what it sounds like you are good at on the mechanical side - pull the motors, etc, and let a pro fix the glasswork for you. That said, it's not rocket science. You will just have to peel into to until you get to a solid laminate, and repair it in such a way that the cracks don't come back.

Here is some reading for you - maybe good for comparisons sake when you take a closer look at yours:

http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/15927-mako-282-cracks-hull-transom.html

http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/192393-mako-1999-282-a.html

904polarized
03-19-2012, 12:49 PM
What year is the hull - 90's?

There was a similar issue like this on the 282 hull in that time. No one can tell you your prognosis with out looking in more detail. Might be more cosmetic, might be structural. There was a recall done on some of the 282's. If it's structural, you might be best doing what it sounds like you are good at on the mechanical side - pull the motors, etc, and let a pro fix the glasswork for you. That said, it's not rocket science. You will just have to peel into to until you get to a solid laminate, and repair it in such a way that the cracks don't come back.

Here is some reading for you - maybe good for comparisons sake when you take a closer look at yours:

http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/15927-mako-282-cracks-hull-transom.html

http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/192393-mako-1999-282-a.html


Under his sig it states 2002 Mako 252
Wouldn't this boat be wood free construction?

Bertram42
03-19-2012, 01:04 PM
The boat in question is a 2002 252 Mako and that has nothing to do with the issues with a few of the early 282 Mako's. Different boat and different design.

Cracker
03-19-2012, 01:05 PM
Get an expert involved...

dvd956
03-19-2012, 01:14 PM
Under his sig it states 2002 Mako 252
Wouldn't this boat be wood free construction?

yes it is a 2002 Mako 252 ...

Kennay
03-19-2012, 02:10 PM
PO probably hit something.

23Dorado
03-19-2012, 02:13 PM
PO probably hit something.

I would guess it's some more of that infamous Tracker Marine built quality. Or lack of quality.

dvd956
03-19-2012, 03:42 PM
ok here are some pics... don't know if they help or not... when I put both engines up and try to push them up and down, the crack opens (in the top) like 2 mm but looks like the rest of the transom is firm, again its my visual opinion!!!


http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1287.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1298.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1288.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1286.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1299.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1301.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1303.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1302.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1305.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1312.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1309.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1299.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1291.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1305.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1313.jpg

dvd956
03-19-2012, 03:46 PM
anyways I will get it checked by a pro, any recommendations for someone here in Miami FL ??
all the help is greatly appreciated !!!
thank you all !!!

Bayfly
03-19-2012, 03:51 PM
I second the vote on this suggestion, especially from your level of expertise with boats.:thumbsup:
I would drag the boat over to a Fiberglass Repair shop or hire a surveyor and have them put a moisture meter on the transom and sound it out with a hammer. They can tell if there is any moisture or delamination. It may be cosmetic and it may be structural but have an expert look at it before you go ripping things apart.

captbone
03-19-2012, 04:51 PM
Your running twin 3.0 liter DFI 200 hps. 200hp EFIs on the day were 2.5 liters and much lighter. Your current engines are around 510lb each.

Even with that much weight, the cracks dont seem to indicate a total transom failure. The engines are not going to fall off tomorrow but it is somthing to keep an eye on.

jayyy
03-19-2012, 05:26 PM
Unfortunately that seller was lying in wait for a new to boating buyer to dump this boat on. If it's just the transom there are lots of pro's that can make the transom better than new without being cost prohibitive, best of luck.

jonesg
03-19-2012, 05:49 PM
Its not cosmetic.

There are no black lines of death running down the transom from the engine bolts, no obvious evidence of rot so its not rot but impact or plain old structural failure, but failure it is.

fishingfun
03-19-2012, 05:56 PM
So do you mind saying how much you paid for the boat?

littletunny
03-19-2012, 06:07 PM
Ahhh fear not my friend. Some folks on this board dont understand how boats are built.

Not to be condescending cause I am not sure what you know about boat construction but here it goes (simplified):

The hull and the liner have to be joined together. Most if manufacturers do this by screwing and glueing the hull to the liner. Then they cover this up joint with the rubrail so you never see it.

But what about the transom? Of course your rubrail ends at the transom. This is where it gets tricky. You have to make the connection at the transom. Most manufacturers make connection by placing putty between the hull and liner prior to attachment and then grind down the putty and gelcoat it after it cures. The problem is the putty is very brittle and over time may crack because the rest the of hull / liner joint consisting of the screwed / glued will move ever so slightly. The manufacturer SHOULD glass this area but they rarely do due to cost and time.

So why the cracks are DEFINATELY scary, dont bring the chainsaw out just yet. That crack may be in the liner itself, not so much the transom.

dvd956
03-19-2012, 06:08 PM
so do you mind saying how much you paid for the boat?
$14500

dvd956
03-19-2012, 06:14 PM
Ahhh fear not my friend. Some folks on this board dont understand how boats are built.

Not to be condescending cause I am not sure what you know about boat construction but here it goes (simplified):

The hull and the liner have to be joined together. Most if manufacturers do this by screwing and glueing the hull to the liner. Then they cover this up joint with the rubrail so you never see it.

But what about the transom? Of course your rubrail ends at the transom. This is where it gets tricky. You have to make the connection at the transom. Most manufacturers make connection by placing putty between the hull and liner prior to attachment and then grind down the putty and gelcoat it after it cures. The problem is the putty is very brittle and over time may crack because the rest the of hull / liner joint consisting of the screwed / glued will move ever so slightly. The manufacturer SHOULD glass this area but they rarely do due to cost and time.

So why the cracks are DEFINATELY scary, dont bring the chainsaw out just yet. That crack may be in the liner itself, not so much the transom.
:thumbsup:

Bayfly
03-19-2012, 07:42 PM
If that is the case you should still be whole when you are finished dealing with this problem. That is, if all else, including the engines are in good shape. At least from my perspective. Good luck with your transom. :thumbsup:

Ntrain2k
03-20-2012, 03:59 AM
Someone has thrown a fiberglass scab under the splashwell:

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/IMG_1299.jpg

That's not factory.

fishingfun
03-20-2012, 10:03 AM
$14500

Well the good news is you in the boat pretty cheap. The guy still lied to you and I would give him a call no matter what you decide to do.

mjmason1
03-20-2012, 01:10 PM
I may be off line here but, if the transom is solid you shouldn't have any flexing. (even 2mm). Definately go have a pro check it out before going offshore.

jonesg
03-20-2012, 03:37 PM
Someone has thrown a fiberglass scab under the splashwell:


That's not factory.


Good eyes, that repair won't work for beans until the transom is fixed. A splashwell can't hold engines on.

Dillard88
03-27-2012, 09:32 AM
Well the good news is you in the boat pretty cheap. The guy still lied to you and I would give him a call no matter what you decide to do.

Isn't this a buyer beware situation? Maybe the seller knew about it but didn't want to fix it.;?

alka2710
03-27-2012, 12:31 PM
I think you need some bilge cleaner. :). I think you got a real good deal on a boat that might need some work. looks like the motors are worth more than you paid. Did that include the trailer. Anyway good luck.
Al

Bertram42
03-27-2012, 04:05 PM
DVD956....Did you get a professional opinon yet?

scooperfl
03-27-2012, 04:26 PM
First thing is de-grease and maybe pressure wash the bilge area near the transom so you can inspect the inside. Tilt the engines, and have someone jump on the lower units while you are watching the inside. Hard to tell with the dirt, but the transom stringer-hull tabbing has a line in it.

If the transom moves with just you pushing on it, I suspect it moves ALOT with 400HP pushing that hull in any kind of sea.

With the previous patching, there is obviously a problem.

dvd956
03-29-2012, 05:02 AM
DVD956....Did you get a professional opinon yet?

I just called a local company and they sent a guy for the inspection, he told me I need to get the engines off and then he needed to drill a hole ( see pic below) so he could work making a patch/reinforce the transom... then finish the cosmetic on top !
I did not like the idea very much, so Im waiting to get someone else involved and check with different people to find a better solution to it !!!
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/photo-6.jpg

dvd956
03-29-2012, 05:04 AM
I think you need some bilge cleaner. :). I think you got a real good deal on a boat that might need some work. looks like the motors are worth more than you paid. Did that include the trailer. Anyway good luck.
Al
yes trailer was included, a 2005 aluminum trailer... and I did put some degreaser on the bilge area but wont come off, will try something different next time :)

dvd956
03-29-2012, 05:04 AM
First thing is de-grease and maybe pressure wash the bilge area near the transom so you can inspect the inside. Tilt the engines, and have someone jump on the lower units while you are watching the inside. Hard to tell with the dirt, but the transom stringer-hull tabbing has a line in it.

If the transom moves with just you pushing on it, I suspect it moves ALOT with 400HP pushing that hull in any kind of sea.

With the previous patching, there is obviously a problem.

yes, transom moves !!!!!!

jtharmo
03-29-2012, 05:35 AM
hell worst case, spend 1-3k to fix transom (that is if its really bad) and u still have one hell of a deal
guys on here buy boat knowing it needs transom fixed, deck replaced, new rigging, new engines and spend way more than that.
"you can completely redo a 1970's boat, but you still have a '70s boat", you will have a perfectly good boat, and nicer engines.

that crack is definitely at the high stressed potion of the transom cap, doesn't mean the crack continues thru the entire transom, like others say, it looks like a capping issue, not a complete transom issue

Wolakrab
03-29-2012, 05:44 AM
The seller knew of the problem, and that's why you got a smokin' deal. Break out another couple of thousand and get a good fiberglass guy to fix it. Call the guy who sold you the boat and tell him he's a POS...

Contractor
03-29-2012, 05:52 AM
The seller knew of the problem, and that's why you got a smokin' deal. Break out another couple of thousand and get a good fiberglass guy to fix it. Call the guy who sold you the boat and tell him he's a POS...

This is pretty much what I was thinking....I'd put a little emphasis on telling the guy what a POS he is.

:thumbsup:

meii
03-29-2012, 05:59 AM
Looks like the knees have separated at the hull joint. Appears as though you could see where they had been moving.

Also looks like the stringer has two cracks in it. This appears in the large rust stain in one of the pics with a tube running through a limber hole.

Just my observations.

To the op.

Have a expert look at it, fix it, and enjoy your mako. Chalk it up to experience.

AutumnK
03-29-2012, 06:02 AM
Had a similar situation with my hewes I bought. Had some cracks on the transom that the seller did show me. Wasnt sure how bad it was but was a great deal. Bought the boat and had my fiberglass guy pull the bracket off and fix it. Turned out to not be a big deal at all....Well until a tree fell on it...:)

mduran
03-29-2012, 06:34 AM
Upside.. you got a really good deal, even if you have to R&R the transome. I bought a used boat years ago.. got a really good deal on her.. for the next 4 months I was pouring money into her for this and that. After another 4K in her, I still felt she was a good deal. Once you get the transome taken care of, you are going to have one bad ass ride.

fishingfun
03-29-2012, 06:43 AM
I'd still call the guy who sold you the boat and F with him some. When your hanging up the phone be making the comment your lawyer will be filing the paper work.

Dillard88
03-29-2012, 07:08 AM
this is pretty much what i was thinking....i'd put a little emphasis on telling the guy what a pos he is.

:thumbsup:

the op still knew about the cracks..................

Gary999
03-29-2012, 07:27 AM
PO probably hit something.

:thumbsup: And used the insurance money for new engines and skimped on the transom repair.

jacksdad
03-29-2012, 07:36 AM
Hey DVD just wanted to say you've got a great attitude about this! If you were in my area i'd make sure you got plenty of invites to fish while your boat is getting fixed.

jonesg
03-29-2012, 07:53 AM
I just called a local company and they sent a guy for the inspection, he told me I need to get the engines off and then he needed to drill a hole ( see pic below) so he could work making a patch/reinforce the transom... then finish the cosmetic on top !
I did not like the idea very much, so Im waiting to get someone else involved and check with different people to find a better solution to it !!!
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d168/davidm33126/photo-6.jpg

Thats a real problem in the repair industry, its full of cowboys.
Think about it, he wants to cut a huge hole ABOVE the water line?

Look at photo series #9 and where stress cracks will appear.
http://www.customboatrepairs.com/jmla/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=48:tips-on-buying-a-used-boat&catid=8:boat-buying-tips&Itemid=7

dvd956
03-29-2012, 12:18 PM
Hey DVD just wanted to say you've got a great attitude about this! If you were in my area i'd make sure you got plenty of invites to fish while your boat is getting fixed.

Thanks!!!

and thank you all for the help... I am trying to find some GOOD local fiberglass expert so I can get the boat fixed ASAP, summer is steps away and I want to get ready so I can enjoy with my friends and family !!!

David.:)

seeken-der-specken
03-29-2012, 01:37 PM
Do not run that boat until you've had some serious repairs made to it. There's lots of experienced boaters on here, but my stomach turned for you when I saw those pics. Sorry.

Capt Bud4222
03-29-2012, 06:43 PM
As per others...... take your time and get it repaired correctly before heading out. You want to spend years enjoying this boat, safely, not cursing it because it left you in the briny deep!!!

snapperkid
03-29-2012, 07:18 PM
Don't worry about it. A good glass guy can fix it all and be near new. Ask FLOT I think he is down your way. He may know of a good glass man. Good deal on the boat!

Bertram42
03-29-2012, 07:20 PM
Not sure I agree with your fiberglass guys approach. Did you have a surveyor sound it out and take moisture meter reading? Do this to get a diagnoses before you have some one start hacking your boat up.

GCC
03-29-2012, 07:35 PM
Steer clear of the retard that wants to cut that hole in the side to repair it. Take it to a reputable repair shop as others have suggested already....



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0